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Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2009 09:53:41 +0300
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From: Dorin Cheptea <dorin.cheptea@gmail.com>
To: Wikipedia statistics <folks@wikipedometer.net>
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	Content preview:  Answers to Andres' questions: Most Russian-language
	votters did indeed vote for the Party of the Communists, but also for
	2-3 other tiny parties that got around 2% each. However, they do not
	represent the majority of the votters for the communists, as 78-79% of
	population are Moldovans (Romanians). [...] 
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	Content preview:  Answers to Andres' questions: Most Russian-language
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	2-3 other tiny parties that got around 2% each. However, they do not
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Answers to Andres' questions:

Most Russian-language votters did indeed vote for the Party of the
Communists, but also for 2-3 other tiny parties that got around 2% each.
However, they do not represent the majority of the votters for the
communists, as 78-79% of population are Moldovans (Romanians).

The participation rate, 59.5% was very high, given the fact that most of th=
e
missing 40% (1 million votes) can be attributed to those that work abroad
Moldova (the middle generation, 25-30 to 50-55 years old). These people wer=
e
counted during the latest census as living in Moldova, even if not
physically present, due to the fact that they have Moldovan citizenship and
specific permanent residence here. Among those that were here on April 5
(election day last Sunday), the participation rate was very high.

Among elderly (50-60 years or older), most votted for the communists,
regardless of their ethnic belonging. Among the protesters, also there is n=
o
ethnic homgeneity. For example in B=E3l=FEi, there are 60% Romanian speaker=
s and
40% Russian speakers in the general population, while yesterday among the
people detained there were many Russians as well (ethnically, perhpas
80%:20% Moldovans:Russians among the protesters). Some of them spoke
Romanian with accent, others could only understand it but did not speak it,
and to one 18 years old guy we had to repeat some things in Russian, becaus=
e
otherwise he would get only the meaning of half. Among the policemen, there
is also no ethnic homogeneity. With one exception: when they swear heavily,
it's in Russian. Not all policemen behaved badly. There were many quite
correct and civilized. For example those in riot gear never hit anybody, an=
d
would let people pass through once their chief in civilian clothes would go
to the other end. The bad-behaved policemen were mostly in civilian, as wel=
l
as older ones in ordinary police uniform. At the police station, there were
basically 2 guys who screamed and sweared all the time, a dosen who never
intimidated anybody and were quite correct (with whom you could also speak
if they were alone), and the rest were in-between, screeming when their
superiors were nearby and doing nothing in rest. The whole thing was about
intimidation, knowing that it can have effect on many 18-years old.

The Voronin's "balanced" politcs between west and Russia was in late 2003 t=
o
early 2005, when he angered Putin with his refusal to sign Kozak memorandum=
,
and when Europeans and Americans were very influencial. By now, Europeans
and Americnas have lost almost all influence over him, while Putin regained
it. The problem is he basically have built a police state in Moldova. He
appointed people in positions they do not desearve professionally, making
their financial situation totally dependent on his political survival.

Moldova's flag is the blue-yellow-red tricolor with the coat of arms on it.
The coat of arms was added by the parliament sometime in 1991. Before that,
it was simply the tricolor (official since April 1990, and unofficial
before). It is easy to make a flag from colored threads one can buy, and on=
e
would save money (instead of buying the official flag). However, during the
protests, the flag with and without the coat of arms was present, without
anybody to care about it. It is not true that the portesters in Chi=BAin=E3=
u put
the Romanian flag on top of the parliament and presidency. They put a lot o=
f
flags, with and without coat of arms, and at least a couple European flags.

Romania has to do with this as much as that there are thousands of Moldovan=
s
who work or study there. Romanian officials were taken by surprise by the
quickly developing events. The core of the protesters come from inside the
country, because those abroad are financially better and do not feel the
urge so keenly to protest. Most protesters do not have parents at home:
their parents are in Italy, Spain, Portugal, Greece, Moscow, etc. They are
left in the care of their older brothers or aunts. After they finish high
school, they need money to go through university (including a lot in the
form of bribes), and after they have almost no oppotunity for normal
employment. Therefore, they represent such a critical mass.

About Transnistria, the village of Corjova (separated from the city of
Dub=E3sari in Tiraspol hands only by a street) is under Moldovan
administration, and in all localities under Moldovan administration the
election was held. Moreover, people in other localities could come to
election polls in nearby localities in Moldovan hands and vote there in
special lists. The problem is that Transnistrian MGB (security) broght in
about 300 individuals from Tiraspol, R=E2bni=FEa and Dub=E3sari, some of th=
em
Cossaks, to block the election section in Corjova. People could then go to
vote in the nearby village of Cocieri, also on the eastern side of Dniester=
,
but that's some 4-5 km apart and most did not go.

Dorin

On 08/04/2009, Digwuren <digwuren@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 2009/4/5 Dorin Cheptea <dorin.cheptea@gmail.com>
>
>> Party of the Communists (this is the official name; president Voronin) :
>> 45.5% --> 55 out of 101 MPs
>>
>> Liberal Party (Chirtoaca, mayor of Chisinau): 13.9% --> 17 MPs
>> Liberal Democratic Party (Filat): 13.9% --> 17 MPs
>> Our Moldova Alliance (Urechean): 12% --> 12 MPs
>> other parties: 16.6% --> 0 MPs
>>
>
>
> Silver Meikar, an Estonian MP of Riigikogu's Moldova Friendship Group,
> claims that exit polls show that the Communist victory was mainly due to
> Russian-language voters, not the elderly in <
> http://www.postimees.ee/?id=3D104762>.  Specifically, he claims that many
> young voters supported Voronin's party due to its balanced course between
> integration with West and good relations with Russia.
>
>
> How does this fit with local analyses?
>
>
> Also, is there anything to Voronin's claims that Romanian government was
> behind the rioting?  Apparently, he claims that attaching Romania's flags=
 to
> Moldova's state office buildings is evidence supporting this theory -- bu=
t
> to me, it sounds rather strange.  Maybe he's just searching for the famou=
s
> but elusive Foreign Enemy?
>
>
>
>>  Aparently, problems at the elections were only in the village of
>> [[Corjova]] in Transnistria.
>>
>
>
> I didn't know that Transnistrians can vote on Moldova elections.  What we=
re
> their preferences?
>
>
> --
> Andres Soolo
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikipedia statistics discussion list
> folks@wikipedometer.net
> http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks
>
>

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<div>Answers to Andres&#39; questions:</div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>Most Russian-language votters did indeed vote for the Party of the Com=
munists, but also for 2-3 other tiny parties that got around 2% each. Howev=
er, they do not represent the majority of the votters for the communists, a=
s 78-79% of population are Moldovans (Romanians). </div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The participation rate, 59.5% was very high, given the fact that most =
of the missing 40% (1 million votes) can be attributed to those that work a=
broad Moldova (the middle generation, 25-30 to 50-55 years old). These peop=
le were counted during the latest census as living in Moldova, even if not =
physically present, due to the fact that they have Moldovan citizenship and=
 specific permanent residence here.=A0Among those that=A0were here on April=
 5 (election day last Sunday), the participation rate was very high.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>Among elderly (50-60 years or older), most votted for the communists, =
regardless of their ethnic belonging.=A0Among the protesters, also there is=
 no ethnic homgeneity. For example in B=E3l=FEi, there are 60% Romanian spe=
akers and 40% Russian speakers in the general population, while yesterday a=
mong the people detained there were=A0many Russians as well (ethnically, pe=
rhpas 80%:20% Moldovans:Russians among the protesters). Some of them spoke =
Romanian with accent, others could only understand it but did not speak it,=
 and to one 18 years old guy we had to repeat some things in Russian, becau=
se otherwise he would get only the meaning of half.=A0Among the policemen, =
there is also no ethnic homogeneity. With one exception: when they swear he=
avily, it&#39;s in Russian. Not all policemen behaved badly. There were man=
y quite correct and civilized. For example those in riot gear never hit any=
body, and would let people pass through once their chief in civilian clothe=
s would go to the other end. The bad-behaved policemen were mostly in civil=
ian, as well as older ones in ordinary police uniform. At the police statio=
n, there were basically 2 guys who screamed and sweared all the time, a dos=
en who never intimidated anybody and were quite correct (with whom you coul=
d also speak if they were alone), and the rest were in-between, screeming w=
hen their superiors were nearby and doing nothing in rest. The whole thing =
was about intimidation, knowing that it can have effect on many 18-years ol=
d.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>The Voronin&#39;s &quot;balanced&quot; politcs between west and Russia=
 was in late 2003 to early 2005, when he angered Putin with his refusal to =
sign Kozak memorandum, and when Europeans and Americans were very influenci=
al. By now, Europeans and Americnas have lost almost all influence over him=
, while Putin regained it. The problem is he basically have built a police =
state in Moldova. He appointed people in positions they do not desearve pro=
fessionally, making their financial situation totally dependent on his poli=
tical survival.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>Moldova&#39;s flag is the blue-yellow-red tricolor with the coat of ar=
ms on it. The coat of arms was added by the parliament sometime in 1991. Be=
fore that, it was simply the tricolor (official since April 1990, and unoff=
icial before). It is easy to make a flag from colored threads one can buy, =
and one would save money (instead of buying the official flag). However, du=
ring the protests, the flag with and without the coat of arms was present, =
without anybody to care about it. It is not true that the portesters in Chi=
=BAin=E3u put the Romanian flag on top of the parliament and presidency. Th=
ey put a lot of flags, with and without=A0coat of arms, and at least a coup=
le European flags.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>Romania has to do with this as much as that there are thousands of Mol=
dovans who work or study there.=A0Romanian officials were taken by surprise=
 by the quickly developing events. The core of the protesters come from ins=
ide the country, because those abroad are financially better and do not fee=
l the urge so keenly to protest. Most protesters do not have parents at hom=
e: their parents are in Italy, Spain, Portugal, Greece, Moscow, etc. They a=
re left in the care of their older brothers or aunts. After they finish hig=
h school, they need money to go through university (including a lot in the =
form of bribes), and after they have almost no oppotunity for normal employ=
ment. Therefore, they represent such a critical mass.=A0<br>
=A0</div>
<div>About Transnistria, the village of Corjova (separated from the city of=
 Dub=E3sari in Tiraspol hands only by a street)=A0is=A0under Moldovan admin=
istration, and in all localities under Moldovan administration the election=
 was held. Moreover, people in other localities could come to election poll=
s in nearby localities in Moldovan hands and vote there in special lists. T=
he problem is that Transnistrian MGB (security) broght in about 300 individ=
uals from Tiraspol, R=E2bni=FEa and Dub=E3sari, some of them Cossaks, to bl=
ock the election section in Corjova. People could then go to vote in the ne=
arby village of Cocieri, also on the eastern side of Dniester, but that&#39=
;s some 4-5 km apart and most did not go.</div>

<div>=A0</div>
<div>Dorin</div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div><span class=3D"gmail_quote">On 08/04/2009, <b class=3D"gmail_sendernam=
e">Digwuren</b> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:digwuren@gmail.com">digwuren@gmail.co=
m</a>&gt; wrote:</span>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0=
px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">2009/4/5 Dorin Cheptea <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a =
onclick=3D"return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href=3D"mailto:dor=
in.cheptea@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">dorin.cheptea@gmail.com</a>&gt;</sp=
an><span class=3D"q"><br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0=
px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<div>Party of the Communists (this is the official name; president Voronin)=
 : 45.5% --&gt; 55 out of 101 MPs<br>=A0</div>
<div>Liberal Party (Chirtoaca, mayor of Chisinau): 13.9% --&gt; 17 MPs</div=
>
<div>Liberal Democratic Party (Filat): 13.9% --&gt; 17 MPs</div>
<div>Our Moldova Alliance (Urechean): 12% --&gt; 12 MPs</div>
<div>other parties: 16.6% --&gt; 0 MPs</div></blockquote>
<div><br>=A0</div></span>
<div>Silver Meikar, an Estonian MP of Riigikogu&#39;s Moldova Friendship Gr=
oup, claims that exit polls show that the Communist victory was mainly due =
to Russian-language voters, not the elderly in &lt;<a onclick=3D"return top=
.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href=3D"http://www.postimees.ee/?id=3D1=
04762" target=3D"_blank">http://www.postimees.ee/?id=3D104762</a>&gt;. =A0S=
pecifically, he claims that many young voters supported Voronin&#39;s party=
 due to its balanced course between integration with West and good relation=
s with Russia.</div>

<div><br>=A0</div>
<div>How does this fit with local analyses?</div>
<div><br>=A0</div>
<div>Also, is there anything to Voronin&#39;s claims that Romanian governme=
nt was behind the rioting? =A0Apparently, he claims that attaching Romania&=
#39;s flags to Moldova&#39;s state office buildings is evidence supporting =
this theory -- but to me, it sounds rather strange. =A0Maybe he&#39;s just =
searching for the famous but elusive Foreign Enemy?</div>
<span class=3D"q">
<div><br>=A0</div>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0=
px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<div></div>
<div>Aparently, problems at the elections were only in the village of [[Cor=
jova]] in Transnistria.</div></blockquote>
<div><br>=A0</div></span>
<div>I didn&#39;t know that Transnistrians can vote on Moldova elections. =
=A0What were their preferences?</div>
<div><br>=A0</div></div><span class=3D"sg">-- <br>Andres Soolo<br></span><b=
r>_______________________________________________<br>Wikipedia statistics d=
iscussion list<br><a onclick=3D"return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this=
)" href=3D"mailto:folks@wikipedometer.net">folks@wikipedometer.net</a><br>
<a onclick=3D"return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href=3D"http://=
wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks" target=3D"_blank">http://=
wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks</a><br><br></blockquote></=
div>
<br>

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