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Date: Fri, 1 May 2009 16:23:37 +0300
Message-ID: <f826636f0905010623j290f87a1se683473a2fd6d309@mail.gmail.com>
From: Dorin Cheptea <dorin.cheptea@gmail.com>
To: Wikipedia statistics <folks@wikipedometer.net>
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	Content preview:  Yes,
	there are undeniable seeds of truth in both of your
	remarks. But they should not prevent us from intelligently trying to
	overcome these difficulties. Perhaps I am too optimistic. If
	line-crossing could be backed with hard evidence in simple form, we
	should go ahead. To deal with blame of harassment we should use more
	diplomatic language and tone. The same for moderation: to moderate
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	overcome these difficulties. Perhaps I am too optimistic. If
	line-crossing could be backed with hard evidence in simple form, we
	should go ahead. To deal with blame of harassment we should use more
	diplomatic language and tone. The same for moderation: to moderate one's
	language and tone is allright, as long as we don't "moderate" the
	content and the moral ground. Too idealistic, i know... :) Dorin [...] 
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Yes, there are undeniable seeds of truth in both of your remarks. But they
should not prevent us from intelligently trying to overcome these
difficulties. Perhaps I am too optimistic.

If line-crossing could be backed with hard evidence in simple form, we
should go ahead. To deal with blame of harassment we should use more
diplomatic language and tone. The same for moderation: to moderate one's
language and tone is allright, as long as we don't "moderate" the content
and the moral ground. Too idealistic, i know... :)
Dorin

2009/4/30 Digwuren <digwuren@gmail.com>

>  On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 10:04, Dorin Cheptea <dorin.cheptea@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>>  Exactly. If we can simply outperform them... Plus publically demand
>>> accountability every time they cross the line.
>>
>>
> Does not work.  They'll claim that the constant demands of accountability
> for the constant line-crossings are harassment, and there will be enough
> active fools in the public to support this view.  We've seen it before.
>
>   If to them this would look as attacks, but not to us and to the rest of
>>> the community, the better. (Because they would get radicalized and make more
>>> mistakes, while we can keep cool head and have the community on our side.)
>>
>>
> The community is not a monolith.  It has a lot of views, but in Wikipedia,
> the moderates tend to, well, moderate themselves, and the fringes dominate
> most dramu-prone discussions.
>
> --
> Andres Soolo
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikipedia statistics discussion list
> folks@wikipedometer.net
> http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks
>
>

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<div>Yes, there=A0are undeniable seeds of truth in both of your remarks. Bu=
t=A0they should not prevent us from intelligently trying to overcome these =
difficulties. Perhaps I am too optimistic. </div>
<div>=A0</div>
<div>If line-crossing could be backed with hard evidence in simple form, we=
 should go ahead. To deal with blame of harassment we should use more diplo=
matic language and tone. The same for moderation: to moderate one&#39;s lan=
guage and tone is allright, as long as we don&#39;t &quot;moderate&quot; th=
e content and the moral ground. Too idealistic, i know... :)</div>

<div>Dorin<br><br></div>
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">2009/4/30 Digwuren <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:digwuren@gmail.com">digwuren@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span><br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div class=3D"im">On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 10:04, Dorin Cheptea <span dir=3D=
"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dorin.cheptea@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">dori=
n.cheptea@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">Exactly. If we can simply outper=
form them... Plus publically demand accountability every time they cross th=
e line.</blockquote>
</div></div></blockquote>
<div><br></div></div>
<div>Does not work. =A0They&#39;ll claim that the constant demands of accou=
ntability for the constant line-crossings are harassment, and there will be=
 enough active fools in the public to support this view. =A0We&#39;ve seen =
it before.</div>

<div class=3D"im">
<div><br></div>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">If=A0to them this would look as =
attacks, but not to us and to the rest of the community, the better. (Becau=
se they would get radicalized and make more mistakes, while we can keep coo=
l head and have the community on our side.)</blockquote>
</div></div></blockquote>
<div><br></div></div>
<div>The community is not a monolith. =A0It has a lot of views, but in Wiki=
pedia, the moderates tend to, well, moderate themselves, and the fringes do=
minate most dramu-prone discussions.</div>
<div><br></div></div><font color=3D"#888888">-- <br>Andres Soolo<br></font>=
<br>_______________________________________________<br>Wikipedia statistics=
 discussion list<br><a href=3D"mailto:folks@wikipedometer.net">folks@wikipe=
dometer.net</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks" target=
=3D"_blank">http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks</a><br>=
<br></blockquote></div><br>

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