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Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2009 01:08:22 +0200
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From: Molobo Molobo <molobus@gmail.com>
To: Wikipedia statistics <folks@wikipedometer.net>
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	Content preview:  " The Internet might make local government more
	accountable and > make some positive micro-changes but I doubt it will
	have a regime-changing > effect." The internet "revolution" is over.
	These days regimes and political groups use the internet just like
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	Internet is powerfull tool and I am certain it will be used to control
	society. [...] 
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	have a regime-changing > effect." The internet "revolution" is over.
	These days regimes and political groups use the internet just like other
	media to influence masses. Of course this is only the beginning but the
	signs are here and we can observe not only censorship but also
	manipulation by governments on the web. It might be interesting from
	sociological point of view how for example "flash mobs" and twitter can
	be exploited to manipulate group thinking in, for example, elections.
	Internet is powerfull tool and I am certain it will be used to control
	society. [...] 
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" The Internet might make local government more accountable and
> make some positive micro-changes but I doubt it will have a regime-changi=
ng
> effect."

The internet "revolution" is over. These days regimes and political
groups use the internet just like other media to influence masses. Of
course this is only the beginning but the signs are here and we can
observe not only censorship but also manipulation by governments on
the web. It might be interesting from sociological point of view how
for example "flash mobs" and twitter can be exploited to manipulate
group thinking in, for example, elections. Internet is powerfull tool
and I am certain it will be used to control society.


2009/7/10 radek szulga <rsszulga@gmail.com>:
> On the economic side, the thing is that China's been growing so fast (yes,
> some of the data is sketchy as hell but even assuming a generous adjustme=
nt
> for overstatement) that even a sudden economic slowdown will still mean
> rates of growth which leave every other country jealous. Also, the truth =
is
> a little bit complicated, but in fact the huge masses of peasantry have
> participated in a lot of this prosperity. I don't have my figures handy
> right now but there's been a tremendous drop in extreme poverty (most of
> which is rural) in China and India in the past decade or two - some of th=
ese
> findings have been recently somewhat revised although a lot of that seems=
 to
> be due to a higher standard of what constitutes "poverty" (which itself i=
s a
> mark of progress in a way). And when people are getting rich(er) I'm not
> sure how much the fact of a decayed ideological foundation really matters.
> Also (sorry to pile on a bit but this fairly close to some of the things I
> study for a living) the environmental problems have been increasing but t=
his
> has been true initially in every country that has seen large increases in
> standards of living. After a certain threshold is reached these countries
> diverted more of their resources into cleaning up (some of) the mess they=
've
> made while industrializing/growing and there's no reason to think that it=
'll
> play out differently in China.
>
> On the other hand the the demographic factors are a potential source of
> trouble while who knows what will happen with N.Korea - but that's always
> been the case. The Internet might make local government more accountable =
and
> make some positive micro-changes but I doubt it will have a regime-changi=
ng
> effect.
>
> Radek
>
>
> 2009/7/9 Christian Suciu <christiansuciu@yahoo.com>
>>
>> I agree the protests alone won't dislodge the current regime.=A0China=A0=
has
>> the advantage of being some 92% Han, versus 51% Russian for the USSR in =
1989
>> (and 70% Russian + Ukrainian + Belarusian). Still, restive minorities=A0=
and=A0a
>> decayed ideological foundation=A0and=A0a sudden=A0economic slowdown=A0an=
d=A0a huge
>> mass of peasantry that never shared in the prosperity (evidently not a
>> factor in=A0Singapore)=A0and=A0problems in the=A0industrial sector=A0(in=
cluding
>> looming environmental catastrophe)=A0and=A0a demographic crisis (plummet=
ing
>> birthrates and a vast excess of males)=A0and=A0regional instability
>> (Korea)=A0and=A0wild-card factors such as the Internet* and the=A0spread=
 of
>> Christianity=A0might amount to something -- possibly.
>> *I'm not saying a keyboard can defeat a tank, but for instance, after
>> the=A0Sichuan earthquake, it was angry people on the Internet that event=
ually
>> got the shoddy schoolwork construction scandal to the fore. The centre t=
hen
>> punished the local authorities responsible, but it doesn't seem impossib=
le
>> anger could one day soon be turned at=A0Peking=A0as well.
>> Anyway, as a monarchist, I support placing=A0Hengzhen, the=A0Manchu=A0pr=
etender
>> to the throne, in power, though I rather doubt there's much enthusiasm f=
or
>> that option, a full 97 years after China became a republic.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>
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