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Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2009 06:41:32 -0500
Message-ID: <25890ca0908190441s43f1f6a8lbcba332c8d2a052d@mail.gmail.com>
From: radek szulga <rsszulga@gmail.com>
To: Wikipedia statistics <folks@wikipedometer.net>
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	Content preview:  What's this one about?
	http://www.trend.infopartisan.net/trd1203/t061203.html 2009/8/19 Molobo
	Molobo <molobus@gmail.com> > Ok now Skapperod is aiming to derail the
	situation by claiming all those > sources are not RS: > > Here is what
	to do: > > Add > >
	http://books.google.pl/books?id=oGmTs2SceAgC&pg=PA27&dq=heinz+nawratil&ei=SM-LSqicMI2-zATOkYybDg#v=onepage&q=heinz%20nawratil&f=false
	> Redrawing nations: ethnic cleansing in East-Central Europe, 1944-1948
	Ana > SiljakPhilipp Ther, Ana Siljak > Page 27:clearly writes that
	Nawratil is nationalist > > > Expelling the Germans: British opinion
	and
	post-1945 population transfer > Matthew James Frank > page > > >
	http://books.google.com/books?id=5J9OtZ-CxtYC&pg=PA4&dq=Nawratil+revisionist&lr=&as_brr=3&ei=cSJ6SqnzCaniyQT81eXMDA&hl=pl#v=onepage&q=Nawratil%20revisionist&f=false
	> Page 4:names Nawratil works as revisionist > > Both are reliable and
	based on them we already can describe Nawratil as > nationalist
	revisionist > > Nawratil also writes for the far right newspaper Junge
	Freiheit and signed > the appeal to protect one of its symphatizers: >
	> The appeal can be found here: > >
	http://www.swg-hamburg.de/Archiv/Beitrage_aus_der_Rubrik_-_Mili/Appell_an_die_Bundeswehr_Gegen_die_Entlassung_konservativer_Soldaten.pdf
	> > And Nawratil is clearly under people who signed this. > > Das
	Weltbild der Intellektuellen rechten in der Bundesrepublik Deutschland
	> Klaus Kornexl > (the worldview of right-wing intellectuals in
	Bundesrepublik Deutschland) > gives Nawratil as one of the examples: >
	page 503-504 > >
	http://books.google.pl/books?id=_QJ3km_zBJcC&pg=PA505&lpg=PA505&dq=%22junge+freiheit%22+nawratil&source=bl&ots=_BlmcN9Qru&sig=pyXvmWcIoNLxWiBvjy4Ch53VbH4&hl=pl&ei=_NKLSs39CImK_AaYt7mSCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9#v=onepage&q=Nawratil&f=false
	> > Nawratil is listed as discussion partner of the far-right student >
	corporation: > http://www.danubia-muenchen.de/archiv.php > > German
	wiki names it as extreme-right wing: >
	http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burschenschaft_Danubia_M%C3%BCnchen > >
	The
	student corporations review (which Skapperod opposed) actually is >
	posted on couple of German [...] 
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Subject: Re: [WPM] Nawratil BLP/Skapperod is nailed Radek :)
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	Content preview:  What's this one about?
	http://www.trend.infopartisan.net/trd1203/t061203.html 2009/8/19 Molobo
	Molobo <molobus@gmail.com> > Ok now Skapperod is aiming to derail the
	situation by claiming all those > sources are not RS: > > Here is what
	to do: > > Add > >
	http://books.google.pl/books?id=oGmTs2SceAgC&pg=PA27&dq=heinz+nawratil&ei=SM-LSqicMI2-zATOkYybDg#v=onepage&q=heinz%20nawratil&f=false
	> Redrawing nations: ethnic cleansing in East-Central Europe, 1944-1948
	Ana > SiljakPhilipp Ther, Ana Siljak > Page 27:clearly writes that
	Nawratil is nationalist > > > Expelling the Germans: British opinion and
	post-1945 population transfer > Matthew James Frank > page > > >
	http://books.google.com/books?id=5J9OtZ-CxtYC&pg=PA4&dq=Nawratil+revisionist&lr=&as_brr=3&ei=cSJ6SqnzCaniyQT81eXMDA&hl=pl#v=onepage&q=Nawratil%20revisionist&f=false
	> Page 4:names Nawratil works as revisionist > > Both are reliable and
	based on them we already can describe Nawratil as > nationalist
	revisionist > > Nawratil also writes for the far right newspaper Junge
	Freiheit and signed > the appeal to protect one of its symphatizers: > >
	The appeal can be found here: > >
	http://www.swg-hamburg.de/Archiv/Beitrage_aus_der_Rubrik_-_Mili/Appell_an_die_Bundeswehr_Gegen_die_Entlassung_konservativer_Soldaten.pdf
	> > And Nawratil is clearly under people who signed this. > > Das
	Weltbild der Intellektuellen rechten in der Bundesrepublik Deutschland >
	Klaus Kornexl > (the worldview of right-wing intellectuals in
	Bundesrepublik Deutschland) > gives Nawratil as one of the examples: >
	page 503-504 > >
	http://books.google.pl/books?id=_QJ3km_zBJcC&pg=PA505&lpg=PA505&dq=%22junge+freiheit%22+nawratil&source=bl&ots=_BlmcN9Qru&sig=pyXvmWcIoNLxWiBvjy4Ch53VbH4&hl=pl&ei=_NKLSs39CImK_AaYt7mSCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9#v=onepage&q=Nawratil&f=false
	> > Nawratil is listed as discussion partner of the far-right student >
	corporation: > http://www.danubia-muenchen.de/archiv.php > > German wiki
	names it as extreme-right wing: >
	http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burschenschaft_Danubia_M%C3%BCnchen > > The
	student corporations review (which Skapperod opposed) actually is >
	posted on couple of German [...] 
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What's this one about?
http://www.trend.infopartisan.net/trd1203/t061203.html

2009/8/19 Molobo Molobo <molobus@gmail.com>

> Ok now Skapperod is aiming to derail the situation by claiming all those
> sources are not RS:
>
> Here is what to do:
>
> Add
>
> http://books.google.pl/books?id=3DoGmTs2SceAgC&pg=3DPA27&dq=3Dheinz+nawra=
til&ei=3DSM-LSqicMI2-zATOkYybDg#v=3Donepage&q=3Dheinz%20nawratil&f=3Dfalse
> Redrawing nations: ethnic cleansing in East-Central Europe, 1944-1948 Ana
> SiljakPhilipp Ther, Ana Siljak
> Page 27:clearly writes that  Nawratil is nationalist
>
>
> Expelling the Germans: British opinion and post-1945 population transfer
> Matthew James Frank
> page
>
>
> http://books.google.com/books?id=3D5J9OtZ-CxtYC&pg=3DPA4&dq=3DNawratil+re=
visionist&lr=3D&as_brr=3D3&ei=3DcSJ6SqnzCaniyQT81eXMDA&hl=3Dpl#v=3Donepage&=
q=3DNawratil%20revisionist&f=3Dfalse
> Page 4:names Nawratil works as revisionist
>
> Both are reliable and based on them we already can describe Nawratil as
> nationalist revisionist
>
> Nawratil also writes for the far right newspaper Junge Freiheit and signe=
d
> the appeal to protect one of its symphatizers:
>
> The appeal can be found here:
>
> http://www.swg-hamburg.de/Archiv/Beitrage_aus_der_Rubrik_-_Mili/Appell_an=
_die_Bundeswehr_Gegen_die_Entlassung_konservativer_Soldaten.pdf
>
> And Nawratil is clearly under people who signed this.
>
> Das Weltbild der Intellektuellen rechten in der Bundesrepublik Deutschlan=
d
> Klaus Kornexl
> (the worldview of right-wing intellectuals in Bundesrepublik Deutschland)
> gives Nawratil as one of the examples:
> page 503-504
>
> http://books.google.pl/books?id=3D_QJ3km_zBJcC&pg=3DPA505&lpg=3DPA505&dq=
=3D%22junge+freiheit%22+nawratil&source=3Dbl&ots=3D_BlmcN9Qru&sig=3DpyXvmWc=
IoNLxWiBvjy4Ch53VbH4&hl=3Dpl&ei=3D_NKLSs39CImK_AaYt7mSCg&sa=3DX&oi=3Dbook_r=
esult&ct=3Dresult&resnum=3D9#v=3Donepage&q=3DNawratil&f=3Dfalse
>
> Nawratil is listed as  discussion partner of the far-right  student
> corporation:
> http://www.danubia-muenchen.de/archiv.php
>
> German wiki names it as extreme-right wing:
> http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burschenschaft_Danubia_M%C3%BCnchen
>
> The student corporations review (which Skapperod opposed) actually is
> posted on couple of German universities and I would dispute that it is
> non-RS.
>
> It also contains reference to the Handbuch des Deutschem Rechtsextremismu=
s
> where more can be learned.
>
> Als what can be added is that all sources do not contain general insults =
or
> attacks against Nawratil but clear and precise information about his
> patricipiation in certain organizations.  So we can ask what part of this
> information is not correct.
>
> I am reading a new source which I found in German which is far right and
> quotes Nawratil who says that low birth in Germany is to be blamed on
> "guilt" for WW2
> http://www.hohewarte.de/MuM/Jahr2003/Selbsterhaltungswille0318.pdf
>
>
>
>
> 2009/8/18 radek szulga <rsszulga@gmail.com>
>
> Is there a way to search in that Handbuch deutscher Rechtsextremismus for
>> Nawratil so that it can be linked to from the BLP page?
>> I posted the other stuff
>>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Not=
iceboard#More_sources_-_in_German
>>
>>
>> 2009/8/18 Molobo Molobo <molobus@gmail.com>
>>
>>> From the below sources I mentioned Zeitgeschichtlichen Forschungsstelle
>>> Ingolstadt=93  where Nawratil works
>>>
>>> And lucky us, it is on wikipedia which I just found out :
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeitgeschichtliche_Forschungsstelle_Ingols=
tadt
>>>
>>> Here is list of workers, with three main ones
>>> mentioned(surprise...Nawratil is one of the three):
>>>
>>> http://www.apabiz.de/archiv/material/Profile/ZFI.htm
>>>
>>> And who is near Nawratil ? Dr. Alfred Schickel -the same revisionistic
>>> person Nawratil congratulated in IHR !
>>>
>>> Below the workers lists you also profile of the organization with extre=
me
>>> right and revisionistic views being mentioned as those represented.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 2009/8/18 Molobo Molobo <molobus@gmail.com>
>>>
>>>> I tried searching for something in German.
>>>> Two facts that I found that might be of interest:
>>>> From University site of Kassal I found a publication that he published
>>>> in several revisionistic newspapers-together with Jorg Heider(known Au=
strian
>>>> far right leader now dead) and politicians from DVU(that is far right =
party
>>>> in Germany)
>>>>
>>>> http://www.gew-huf-kassel.de/docs/Allgemeines/Burschenschaften/ASTA_Ma=
inz_Verbindungen_Reader.pdf
>>>> (the pdf doesn't allow to copy text-the information is on page 35-a
>>>> large paragraph)
>>>> The paragraph can be given a summary of:
>>>> Nawratil published also with Jorg Haider and DVU Chief Gerhard Frey in
>>>> Grabert Verlag. The publication is one of the central organs for
>>>> "revisionist history" and represents views from extreme right to
>>>> neo-fascism.
>>>>
>>>> The other one seems to be more left-based but still contains an
>>>> interesting information:
>>>> http://www.imi-online.de/download/IMI-Studie2008-04.pdf
>>>>
>>>> In it we have information that Nawratil took part in Wiking-Jugend as
>>>> clerk(a far right youth organization) and that he signed an appeal tog=
ether
>>>> with extreme right activists defending a soldier involved with Junge
>>>> Freiheit a extreme right newspaper.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Third-Nawratil is mentioned in Handbuch deutscher
>>>> Rechtsextremismus-handbook of German extreme right as official in
>>>> revisionistic organization institute =84Zeitgeschichtlichen Forschungs=
stelle
>>>> Ingolstadt=93 e.V. (ZFI).
>>>>
>>>> http://www.amazon.de/Handbuch-deutscher-Rechtsextremismus-Jens-Mecklen=
burg/dp/3885205858
>>>> page 895.
>>>>
>>>> Once I started looking into German sources a lot more information
>>>> directly implying his connection to far right and revisionism showed u=
p.
>>>>
>>>> Hope this helps !
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 2009/8/17 Molobo Molobo <molobus@gmail.com>
>>>>
>>>>> Also noted the discussion on BLP-nice try from Skapperod-"sources
>>>>> should state that he is a neo-nazi". A known trick of his. You did no=
t write
>>>>> that he was neo-nazi. In fact one can be a holocaust denier or German
>>>>> nationalist without being neo-nazi. It's a common attempt of Skappero=
d to
>>>>> mud the issue. And common tactic of German nationalists to cover up
>>>>> themselfs as anti-nazi while publishing nationalist writings.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2009/8/17 Molobo Molobo <molobus@gmail.com>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi I was away during the weekend.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Radek did you got my previous sources on him ? I sent them to you a
>>>>>> while ago.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However I did search for new ones and found a couple of useful
>>>>>> sources. One is extremely helpful and reliable:
>>>>>> http://www.h-net.org/reviews/showrev.php?id=3D23744
>>>>>> *By far the most cited secondary source for the DVD-ROM's
>>>>>> "background" passages is Heinz Nawratil's Schwarzbuch der Vertreibun=
g 1945
>>>>>> bis 1948, first published in 1982 and re-issued almost annually ever=
 since.
>>>>>>  It is an unabashedly partisan catalog of German victimization. An e=
xcerpt
>>>>>> titled "Prelude to Expulsion," for example, placed in the midst of v=
ideo
>>>>>> clips about the fall of Breslau, provides an account of German-Polis=
h
>>>>>> relations from 1918 through 1939 that consists exclusively of Polish
>>>>>> mistreatment of Germans. The bibliography provided by the DVD-ROM is=
 taken
>>>>>> directly from the (then) most recent addition of Nawratil's Schwarzb=
uch. It
>>>>>> includes quite a few publications by the National Socialist regime b=
ut none
>>>>>> published in eastern Europe, either before or after 1989. Read as a =
text
>>>>>> document, in other words, Die Grosse Flucht is jarringly dated and
>>>>>> one-sided, a kind of time capsule of the rhetoric of the Bund der
>>>>>> Vertriebenen circa 1955.*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here he is friendly named as fellow revisionist:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v10/v10p--4_OKeefe.html
>>>>>> *
>>>>>> Dr. Alfred Schickel, one of West Germany's leading Revisionist
>>>>>> scholars, then receives his due in a mock scolding or diatribe from =
one of
>>>>>> his colleagues, his fellow Sudeten German Dr. Heinz Nawratil. The ha=
ppy
>>>>>> occasion of Dr. Nawratil's objurgation was the award to Dr. Schickel=
 of one
>>>>>> of the Bundesrepublik's highest civilian honors: favorable breezes a=
re
>>>>>> blowing in our favor, and seem to be picking up strengt*h.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The quote in your link I think rather refers to Borszat as criminal
>>>>>> historians.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2009/8/15 radek szulga <rsszulga@gmail.com>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> > The expulsions page got protected on the BLP issue in regard to
>>>>>> Heinz
>>>>>> > Nawratil. So we've got Haar quoting Broszat that Nawratil was
>>>>>> extreme right
>>>>>> > wing and we got Nawratil's own writings in the Holocaust denial
>>>>>> journal but
>>>>>> > we could use some more for BLP.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Can anyone (Molobo?) translate what this says (search for Nawratil=
):
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=3Den&sl=3Dde&u=3Dhttp://w=
ww.monarchieliga.de/divers/biblio/iv-criticon.htm&ei=3DucmGSu_sF9zMjAeCr7yi=
Cw&sa=3DX&oi=3Dtranslate&resnum=3D9&ct=3Dresult&prev=3D/search%3Fq%3Dheinz%=
2Bnawratil%2Bbroszat%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-=
US:official%26hs%3DRZf%26sa%3DN%26start%3D10
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Using Babel fish I get something about "criminal historians" but I=
'm
>>>>>> not
>>>>>> > sure.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Also any additional sources for Nawratil's extremism would be very
>>>>>> welcome.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Radek
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>>>> > Wikipedia statistics discussion list
>>>>>> > folks@wikipedometer.net
>>>>>> > http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wikipedia statistics discussion list
>>> folks@wikipedometer.net
>>> http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikipedia statistics discussion list
>> folks@wikipedometer.net
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>
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--0016e65aed2cd5801c04717d1d9e
Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

What&#39;s this one about?<br><a href=3D"http://www.trend.infopartisan.net/=
trd1203/t061203.html">http://www.trend.infopartisan.net/trd1203/t061203.htm=
l</a><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">2009/8/19 Molobo Molobo <span dir=
=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:molobus@gmail.com">molobus@gmail.com</a>&gt;=
</span><br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, =
204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">Ok now Skapperod =
is aiming to derail the situation by claiming all those sources are not RS:=
<br>
<br>Here is what to do:<br><br>Add <br><a href=3D"http://books.google.pl/bo=
oks?id=3DoGmTs2SceAgC&amp;pg=3DPA27&amp;dq=3Dheinz+nawratil&amp;ei=3DSM-LSq=
icMI2-zATOkYybDg#v=3Donepage&amp;q=3Dheinz%20nawratil&amp;f=3Dfalse" target=
=3D"_blank">http://books.google.pl/books?id=3DoGmTs2SceAgC&amp;pg=3DPA27&am=
p;dq=3Dheinz+nawratil&amp;ei=3DSM-LSqicMI2-zATOkYybDg#v=3Donepage&amp;q=3Dh=
einz%20nawratil&amp;f=3Dfalse</a><br>

<div style=3D"white-space: nowrap;">Redrawing nations: ethnic cleansing in =
East-Central Europe, 1944-1948 Ana Siljak<span>Philipp Ther, Ana Siljak</sp=
an></div>Page 27:clearly writes that=A0 Nawratil is nationalist<br>
<br><br>Expelling the Germans: British opinion and post-1945 population tra=
nsfer=A0 Matthew James Frank<br>page<br><br><a href=3D"http://books.google.=
com/books?id=3D5J9OtZ-CxtYC&amp;pg=3DPA4&amp;dq=3DNawratil+revisionist&amp;=
lr=3D&amp;as_brr=3D3&amp;ei=3DcSJ6SqnzCaniyQT81eXMDA&amp;hl=3Dpl#v=3Donepag=
e&amp;q=3DNawratil%20revisionist&amp;f=3Dfalse" target=3D"_blank">http://bo=
oks.google.com/books?id=3D5J9OtZ-CxtYC&amp;pg=3DPA4&amp;dq=3DNawratil+revis=
ionist&amp;lr=3D&amp;as_brr=3D3&amp;ei=3DcSJ6SqnzCaniyQT81eXMDA&amp;hl=3Dpl=
#v=3Donepage&amp;q=3DNawratil%20revisionist&amp;f=3Dfalse</a><br>

Page 4:names Nawratil works as revisionist<br><br>Both are reliable and bas=
ed on them we already can describe Nawratil as nationalist revisionist<br><=
br>Nawratil also writes for the far right newspaper Junge Freiheit and sign=
ed the appeal to protect one of its symphatizers:<br>

<br>The appeal can be found here:<br><a href=3D"http://www.swg-hamburg.de/A=
rchiv/Beitrage_aus_der_Rubrik_-_Mili/Appell_an_die_Bundeswehr_Gegen_die_Ent=
lassung_konservativer_Soldaten.pdf" target=3D"_blank">http://www.swg-hambur=
g.de/Archiv/Beitrage_aus_der_Rubrik_-_Mili/Appell_an_die_Bundeswehr_Gegen_d=
ie_Entlassung_konservativer_Soldaten.pdf</a><br>

<br>And Nawratil is clearly under people who signed this.<br><br>Das Weltbi=
ld der Intellektuellen rechten in der Bundesrepublik Deutschland=A0 Klaus K=
ornexl<br>(the worldview of right-wing intellectuals in Bundesrepublik Deut=
schland) gives Nawratil as one of the examples:<br>

page 503-504<br><a href=3D"http://books.google.pl/books?id=3D_QJ3km_zBJcC&a=
mp;pg=3DPA505&amp;lpg=3DPA505&amp;dq=3D%22junge+freiheit%22+nawratil&amp;so=
urce=3Dbl&amp;ots=3D_BlmcN9Qru&amp;sig=3DpyXvmWcIoNLxWiBvjy4Ch53VbH4&amp;hl=
=3Dpl&amp;ei=3D_NKLSs39CImK_AaYt7mSCg&amp;sa=3DX&amp;oi=3Dbook_result&amp;c=
t=3Dresult&amp;resnum=3D9#v=3Donepage&amp;q=3DNawratil&amp;f=3Dfalse" targe=
t=3D"_blank">http://books.google.pl/books?id=3D_QJ3km_zBJcC&amp;pg=3DPA505&=
amp;lpg=3DPA505&amp;dq=3D%22junge+freiheit%22+nawratil&amp;source=3Dbl&amp;=
ots=3D_BlmcN9Qru&amp;sig=3DpyXvmWcIoNLxWiBvjy4Ch53VbH4&amp;hl=3Dpl&amp;ei=
=3D_NKLSs39CImK_AaYt7mSCg&amp;sa=3DX&amp;oi=3Dbook_result&amp;ct=3Dresult&a=
mp;resnum=3D9#v=3Donepage&amp;q=3DNawratil&amp;f=3Dfalse</a><br>

<br>Nawratil is listed as=A0 discussion partner of the far-right=A0 student=
 corporation:<br><a href=3D"http://www.danubia-muenchen.de/archiv.php" targ=
et=3D"_blank">http://www.danubia-muenchen.de/archiv.php</a><br><br>German w=
iki names it as extreme-right wing:<br>

<a href=3D"http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burschenschaft_Danubia_M%C3%BCnchen=
" target=3D"_blank">http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burschenschaft_Danubia_M%C=
3%BCnchen</a><br><br>The student corporations review (which Skapperod oppos=
ed) actually is posted on couple of German universities and I would dispute=
 that it is non-RS.<br>

<br>It also contains reference to the Handbuch des Deutschem Rechtsextremis=
mus where more can be learned.<br><br>Als what can be added is that all sou=
rces do not contain general insults or attacks against Nawratil but clear a=
nd precise information about his patricipiation in certain organizations.=
=A0 So we can ask what part of this information is not correct.<br>

<br>I am reading a new source which I found in German which is far right an=
d quotes Nawratil who says that low birth in Germany is to be blamed on &qu=
ot;guilt&quot; for WW2<br><a href=3D"http://www.hohewarte.de/MuM/Jahr2003/S=
elbsterhaltungswille0318.pdf" target=3D"_blank">http://www.hohewarte.de/MuM=
/Jahr2003/Selbsterhaltungswille0318.pdf</a><br>

<br><br><br>
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">2009/8/18 radek szulga <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt=
;<a href=3D"mailto:rsszulga@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">rsszulga@gmail.com=
</a>&gt;</span><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5"><br><blockquote class=3D"g=
mail_quote" style=3D"border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt=
 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">


Is there a way to search in that Handbuch deutscher Rechtsextremismus for N=
awratil so that it can be linked to from the BLP page?<br>I posted the othe=
r stuff<br><a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of=
_living_persons/Noticeboard#More_sources_-_in_German" target=3D"_blank">htt=
p://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboa=
rd#More_sources_-_in_German</a><div>


<div></div><div><br>
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">2009/8/18 Molobo Molobo <span dir=3D"ltr">&l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:molobus@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">molobus@gmail.com<=
/a>&gt;</span><br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"border-left: 1=
px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"=
>



>From the below sources I mentioned Zeitgeschichtlichen Forschungsstelle Ing=
olstadt=93=A0 where Nawratil works<br><br>And lucky us, it is on wikipedia =
which I just found out :<br><br><br><a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki=
/Zeitgeschichtliche_Forschungsstelle_Ingolstadt" target=3D"_blank">http://e=
n.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeitgeschichtliche_Forschungsstelle_Ingolstadt</a><br>




<br>Here is list of workers, with three main ones mentioned(surprise...Nawr=
atil is one of the three):<br><br><a href=3D"http://www.apabiz.de/archiv/ma=
terial/Profile/ZFI.htm" target=3D"_blank">http://www.apabiz.de/archiv/mater=
ial/Profile/ZFI.htm</a><br>




<br>And who is near Nawratil ? Dr. Alfred Schickel -the same revisionistic =
person Nawratil congratulated in IHR !<br><br>Below the workers lists you a=
lso profile of the organization with extreme right and revisionistic views =
being mentioned as those represented.<br>




<br><br><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">2009/8/18 Molobo Molobo <span di=
r=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:molobus@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">molobu=
s@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span><br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"bo=
rder-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding=
-left: 1ex;">




I tried searching for something in German.<br>Two facts that I found that m=
ight be of interest:<br>From University site of Kassal I found a publicatio=
n that he published in several revisionistic newspapers-together with Jorg =
Heider(known Austrian far right leader now dead) and politicians from DVU(t=
hat is far right party in Germany)<br>





<a href=3D"http://www.gew-huf-kassel.de/docs/Allgemeines/Burschenschaften/A=
STA_Mainz_Verbindungen_Reader.pdf" target=3D"_blank">http://www.gew-huf-kas=
sel.de/docs/Allgemeines/Burschenschaften/ASTA_Mainz_Verbindungen_Reader.pdf=
</a><br>




(the pdf doesn&#39;t allow to copy text-the information is on page 35-a lar=
ge paragraph)<br>
The paragraph can be given a summary of:<br>Nawratil published also with Jo=
rg Haider and DVU Chief Gerhard Frey in Grabert Verlag. The publication is =
one of the central organs for &quot;revisionist history&quot; and represent=
s views from extreme right to neo-fascism.<br>





<br>The other one seems to be more left-based but still contains an interes=
ting information:<br><a href=3D"http://www.imi-online.de/download/IMI-Studi=
e2008-04.pdf" target=3D"_blank">http://www.imi-online.de/download/IMI-Studi=
e2008-04.pdf</a><br>





<br>In it we have information that Nawratil took part in Wiking-Jugend as c=
lerk(a far right youth organization) and that he signed an appeal together =
with extreme right activists defending a soldier involved with Junge Freihe=
it a extreme right newspaper.<br>





<br><br>Third-Nawratil is mentioned in Handbuch deutscher Rechtsextremismus=
-handbook of German extreme right as official in revisionistic organization=
 institute =84Zeitgeschichtlichen Forschungsstelle Ingolstadt=93 e.V.  (ZFI=
). <br>





<a href=3D"http://www.amazon.de/Handbuch-deutscher-Rechtsextremismus-Jens-M=
ecklenburg/dp/3885205858" target=3D"_blank">http://www.amazon.de/Handbuch-d=
eutscher-Rechtsextremismus-Jens-Mecklenburg/dp/3885205858</a><br>page 895.<=
br>




<br>Once I started looking into German sources a lot more information direc=
tly implying his connection to far right and revisionism showed up. <br>
<br>Hope this helps !<br><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">2009/8/17 Molob=
o Molobo <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:molobus@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">molobus@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span><br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_=
quote" style=3D"border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt =
0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">





Also noted the discussion on BLP-nice try from Skapperod-&quot;sources shou=
ld state that he is a neo-nazi&quot;. A known trick of his. You did not wri=
te that he was neo-nazi. In fact one can be a holocaust denier or German na=
tionalist without being neo-nazi. It&#39;s a common attempt of Skapperod to=
 mud the issue. And common tactic of German nationalists to cover up themse=
lfs as anti-nazi while publishing nationalist writings.<br>






<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">2009/8/17 Molobo Molobo <span dir=3D"ltr">&l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:molobus@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">molobus@gmail.com<=
/a>&gt;</span><div><div></div><div><br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" st=
yle=3D"border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex=
; padding-left: 1ex;">






Hi I was away during the weekend. <br><br>Radek did you got my previous sou=
rces on him ? I sent them to you a while ago.<br><br>However I did search f=
or new ones and found a couple of useful sources. One is extremely helpful =
and reliable:<br>







<a href=3D"http://www.h-net.org/reviews/showrev.php?id=3D23744" target=3D"_=
blank">http://www.h-net.org/reviews/showrev.php?id=3D23744</a><br><i>By far=
 the most cited secondary source for the DVD-ROM&#39;s &quot;background&quo=
t; passages is Heinz Nawratil&#39;s Schwarzbuch der Vertreibung 1945 bis 19=
48, first published in 1982 and re-issued almost annually ever since. =A0It=
 is an unabashedly partisan catalog of German victimization. An excerpt tit=
led &quot;Prelude to Expulsion,&quot; for example, placed in the midst of v=
ideo clips about the fall of Breslau, provides an account of German-Polish =
relations from 1918 through 1939 that consists exclusively of Polish mistre=
atment of Germans. The bibliography provided by the DVD-ROM is taken direct=
ly from the (then) most recent addition of Nawratil&#39;s Schwarzbuch. It i=
ncludes quite a few publications by the National Socialist regime but none =
published in eastern Europe, either before or after 1989. Read as a text do=
cument, in other words, Die Grosse Flucht is jarringly dated and one-sided,=
 a kind of time capsule of the rhetoric of the Bund der Vertriebenen circa =
1955.</i><br>







<br>Here he is friendly named as fellow revisionist:<br><br><a href=3D"http=
://www.ihr.org/jhr/v10/v10p--4_OKeefe.html" target=3D"_blank">http://www.ih=
r.org/jhr/v10/v10p--4_OKeefe.html</a><br><i><br>Dr. Alfred Schickel, one of=
 West Germany&#39;s leading Revisionist
scholars, then receives his due in a mock scolding or diatribe from one
of his colleagues, his fellow Sudeten German Dr. Heinz Nawratil. The
happy occasion of Dr. Nawratil&#39;s objurgation was the award to Dr.
Schickel of one of the Bundesrepublik&#39;s highest civilian honors:
favorable breezes are blowing in our favor, and seem to be picking up
strengt</i>h.<br><br>The quote in your link I think rather refers to Borsza=
t as criminal historians.<br><br><br>2009/8/15 radek szulga &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:rsszulga@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">rsszulga@gmail.com</a>&gt;:<di=
v>






<div></div><div><br>&gt; The expulsions page got protected on the BLP issue=
 in regard to Heinz<br>
&gt; Nawratil. So we&#39;ve got Haar quoting Broszat that Nawratil was extr=
eme right<br>&gt; wing and we got Nawratil&#39;s own writings in the Holoca=
ust denial journal but<br>&gt; we could use some more for BLP.<br>&gt;<br>







&gt; Can anyone (Molobo?) translate what this says (search for Nawratil):<b=
r>&gt;<br>&gt; <a href=3D"http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=3Den&a=
mp;sl=3Dde&amp;u=3Dhttp://www.monarchieliga.de/divers/biblio/iv-criticon.ht=
m&amp;ei=3DucmGSu_sF9zMjAeCr7yiCw&amp;sa=3DX&amp;oi=3Dtranslate&amp;resnum=
=3D9&amp;ct=3Dresult&amp;prev=3D/search%3Fq%3Dheinz%2Bnawratil%2Bbroszat%26=
hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26hs%3DRZf%=
26sa%3DN%26start%3D10" target=3D"_blank">http://translate.google.co.uk/tran=
slate?hl=3Den&amp;sl=3Dde&amp;u=3Dhttp://www.monarchieliga.de/divers/biblio=
/iv-criticon.htm&amp;ei=3DucmGSu_sF9zMjAeCr7yiCw&amp;sa=3DX&amp;oi=3Dtransl=
ate&amp;resnum=3D9&amp;ct=3Dresult&amp;prev=3D/search%3Fq%3Dheinz%2Bnawrati=
l%2Bbroszat%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:offici=
al%26hs%3DRZf%26sa%3DN%26start%3D10</a><br>







&gt;<br>&gt; Using Babel fish I get something about &quot;criminal historia=
ns&quot; but I&#39;m not<br>&gt; sure.<br>&gt;<br>&gt; Also any additional =
sources for Nawratil&#39;s extremism would be very welcome.<br>&gt;<br>







&gt; Radek<br>&gt;<br>&gt;<br></div></div>&gt; ____________________________=
___________________<br>&gt; Wikipedia statistics discussion list<br>&gt; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:folks@wikipedometer.net" target=3D"_blank">folks@wikipedome=
ter.net</a><br>






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rget=3D"_blank">http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks</a>=
<br>
&gt;<br>&gt;<br><br>
</blockquote></div></div></div><br>
</blockquote></div><br>
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