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Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:08:12 +0200
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From: Molobo Molobo <molobus@gmail.com>
To: Wikipedia statistics <folks@wikipedometer.net>
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	Content preview:  "I have outlasted almost all Polish editors of "my
	generation", with the exception of Molobo" Considering the amount of
	hatred and attacks I received over the years, sometimes I consider
	myself as an old scared ork ;] But yes, Wiki is stressful. One
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	Content preview:  "I have outlasted almost all Polish editors of "my
	generation", with the exception of Molobo" Considering the amount of
	hatred and attacks I received over the years, sometimes I consider
	myself as an old scared ork ;] But yes, Wiki is stressful. One
	editor(completely from another topic area) decided to leave saying that
	as you grow in years so do you drag attention and "followers" that grow
	in the numbers of attacks, diff's and usual accusations. The thing is
	that that without a well organised support from others, even if they
	lie(which they often do) you will get "hurt"-naive admins, too little
	time to respond to attacks and so on. With this email list defence is a
	bit more likely to happen in such cases. I can't also overestimate one
	important thing from my own personal experience-my amount of wikistress
	always went down when I stopped pointless discussions and concentrated
	on writing articles. It is even more satisfying to see them pissed when
	from one or two sentences you create a full-fledged, well sourced
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"I have outlasted almost all Polish editors of "my generation", with the
exception of Molobo"
Considering the amount of hatred and attacks I received over the years,
sometimes I consider myself as an old scared ork ;]
But yes, Wiki is stressful. One editor(completely from another topic area)
decided to leave saying that as you grow in years so do you drag attention
and "followers" that grow in the numbers of attacks, diff's and usual
accusations. The thing is that that without a well organised support from
others, even if they lie(which they often do) you will get "hurt"-naive
admins, too little time to respond to attacks and so on. With this email
list defence is a bit more likely to happen in such cases. I can't also
overestimate one important thing from my own personal experience-my amount
of wikistress always went down when I stopped pointless discussions and
concentrated on writing articles. It is even more satisfying to see them
pissed when from one or two sentences you create a full-fledged, well
sourced article.

"Where is Irpen, Ghirla,
Kuban Kazak, JC, PK, and some other hate/propaganda mongers? In the end,
their attempts to destroy NPOV and introduce propaganda into Wikipedia
failed. "

Exactly-so will current ones fade away if we pursue article content, defend
each other in wiki attacks and watch over violations.

2009/6/23 Piotr Konieczny <piokon@post.pl>

> Andrei Dombay wrote:
>
> > Keeping certain articles in shape was one of the reasons I did not left
> > long time ago. But I could not do it any more with articles like
> > Litvinenko and Russian apartment bombings. R and O have won, let's put
> > it straight. I failed. Now they can do whatever they want with articles
> > on Russian politics, because no one  cares about them
>
> Based on sanctions and analysis who is active without considering your
> and Dig retirement, I'd still say its a minor victory of our side. We
> still have more unrestricted and experienced users; as somebody
> mentioned before, this is the first time this has happened.
>
> But yes, if you both retire, the situation will look much worse. I
> understand Wiki can be stressful, which is why I have and support a
> bunch of anti-stress strategies (from doing non-stressful edits to
> organizing cabals and spreading the stress around :>), but when a user
> gives up and leaves, that's a shame. It's like one got banned, but
> without the effort of making the other side do so. Or, in other words,
> one becomes a victim of the ongoing psychological warfare we have on wiki
> :(
>
> I have outlasted almost all Polish editors of "my generation", with the
> exception of Molobo. Halibutt, Lysy/Wojsyl, Balcer, Appleseed (Darwinek
> is still here but he refuses to be involved in wikipolitics in any
> extent). They all got tired with wiki disputes, burned out and left.
> Everyone is free to do what they want, but I can't help but think how
> easier it would be for all of us if they stuck around and were here to
> support us. In the end, we can either grow and be stronger, or lose
> members and get weaker. Hence I am all for having TEMPORARY
> wikiholidays, and such (perhaps an editor who wants to avoid wikistress
> could just write content and let others fight over it?), but it pains me
> to hear that one is leaving and that the USSRForever cabal has "won",
> without even winning the visible wiki fight (let me remind you that the
> AE decisions are not so bad to us). Please remember that over the years
> we have managed to get rid of quite a few disruptive users as well, and
> make Wikipedia a better place for those who want to create a neutral
> encyclopedia build in a friendly atmosphere. Where is Irpen, Ghirla,
> Kuban Kazak, JC, PK, and some other hate/propaganda mongers? In the end,
> their attempts to destroy NPOV and introduce propaganda into Wikipedia
> failed. They proved to be no stronger than us, rather, they proved
> weaker. We just have to try to last a little longer.
>
> --
> Piotr Konieczny
>
> "The problem about Wikipedia is, that it just works in reality, not in
> theory."
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikipedia statistics discussion list
> folks@wikipedometer.net
> http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks
>

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&quot;I have outlasted almost all Polish editors of &quot;my generation&quo=
t;, with the<br>
exception of Molobo&quot;<br>Considering the amount of hatred and attacks I=
 received over the years, sometimes I consider myself as an old scared ork =
;] <br>But yes, Wiki is stressful. One editor(completely from another topic=
 area) decided to leave saying that as you grow in years so do you drag att=
ention and &quot;followers&quot; that grow in the numbers of attacks, diff&=
#39;s and usual accusations. The thing is that that without a well organise=
d support from others, even if they lie(which they often do) you will get &=
quot;hurt&quot;-naive admins, too little time to respond to attacks and so =
on. With this email list defence is a bit more likely to happen in such cas=
es. I can&#39;t also overestimate one important thing from my own personal =
experience-my amount of wikistress always went down when I stopped pointles=
s discussions and concentrated on writing articles. It is even more satisfy=
ing to see them pissed when from one or two sentences you create a full-fle=
dged, well sourced article.<br>
<br>&quot;Where is Irpen, Ghirla,<br>
Kuban Kazak, JC, PK, and some other hate/propaganda mongers? In the end,<br=
>
their attempts to destroy NPOV and introduce propaganda into Wikipedia<br>
failed. &quot;<br><br>Exactly-so will current ones fade away if we pursue a=
rticle content, defend each other in wiki attacks and watch over violations=
.<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">2009/6/23 Piotr Konieczny <span dir=3D"=
ltr">&lt;piokon@post.pl&gt;</span><br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, =
204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><div class=3D"im"=
>Andrei Dombay wrote:<br>
<br>
&gt; Keeping certain articles in shape was one of the reasons I did not lef=
t<br>
&gt; long time ago. But I could not do it any more with articles like<br>
&gt; Litvinenko and Russian apartment bombings. R and O have won, let&#39;s=
 put<br>
&gt; it straight. I failed. Now they can do whatever they want with article=
s<br>
&gt; on Russian politics, because no one =A0cares about them<br>
<br>
</div>Based on sanctions and analysis who is active without considering you=
r<br>
and Dig retirement, I&#39;d still say its a minor victory of our side. We<b=
r>
still have more unrestricted and experienced users; as somebody<br>
mentioned before, this is the first time this has happened.<br>
<br>
But yes, if you both retire, the situation will look much worse. I<br>
understand Wiki can be stressful, which is why I have and support a<br>
bunch of anti-stress strategies (from doing non-stressful edits to<br>
organizing cabals and spreading the stress around :&gt;), but when a user<b=
r>
gives up and leaves, that&#39;s a shame. It&#39;s like one got banned, but<=
br>
without the effort of making the other side do so. Or, in other words,<br>
one becomes a victim of the ongoing psychological warfare we have on wiki :=
(<br>
<br>
I have outlasted almost all Polish editors of &quot;my generation&quot;, wi=
th the<br>
exception of Molobo. Halibutt, Lysy/Wojsyl, Balcer, Appleseed (Darwinek<br>
is still here but he refuses to be involved in wikipolitics in any<br>
extent). They all got tired with wiki disputes, burned out and left.<br>
Everyone is free to do what they want, but I can&#39;t help but think how<b=
r>
easier it would be for all of us if they stuck around and were here to<br>
support us. In the end, we can either grow and be stronger, or lose<br>
members and get weaker. Hence I am all for having TEMPORARY<br>
wikiholidays, and such (perhaps an editor who wants to avoid wikistress<br>
could just write content and let others fight over it?), but it pains me<br=
>
to hear that one is leaving and that the USSRForever cabal has &quot;won&qu=
ot;,<br>
without even winning the visible wiki fight (let me remind you that the<br>
AE decisions are not so bad to us). Please remember that over the years<br>
we have managed to get rid of quite a few disruptive users as well, and<br>
make Wikipedia a better place for those who want to create a neutral<br>
encyclopedia build in a friendly atmosphere. Where is Irpen, Ghirla,<br>
Kuban Kazak, JC, PK, and some other hate/propaganda mongers? In the end,<br=
>
their attempts to destroy NPOV and introduce propaganda into Wikipedia<br>
failed. They proved to be no stronger than us, rather, they proved<br>
weaker. We just have to try to last a little longer.<br>
<div class=3D"im"><br>
--<br>
Piotr Konieczny<br>
<br>
&quot;The problem about Wikipedia is, that it just works in reality, not in=
<br>
theory.&quot;<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
</div><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">Wikipedia statistics discussion lis=
t<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:folks@wikipedometer.net">folks@wikipedometer.net</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks" target=
=3D"_blank">http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br>

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