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Date: Sat, 9 May 2009 11:37:15 -0400
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From: Andrei Dombay <wikibiophys@gmail.com>
To: Wikipedia statistics <folks@wikipedometer.net>
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	Content preview:  Also some "otkazniks" went abroad even in 1980s,
	and so
	on. My major point: anyone who was invited by the KGB in 1980s to work
	for them as a computer consultant had to be at classified at least as
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	Content preview:  Also some "otkazniks" went abroad even in 1980s, and so
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Also some "otkazniks" went abroad even in 1980s, and so on. My major point:
anyone who was invited by the KGB in 1980s to work for them as a computer
consultant had to be at classified at least as their "trusted contact" (I
will possibly make an article to explain what is it). They would never ask
someone "from the street". And of course I keep in mind his edits in WP:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Web_brigades&diff=225117708&oldid=225086574

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Internet_operations_by_Russian_secret_police&diff=264359407&oldid=264358991

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Active_measures&diff=154078427&oldid=154076928

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Red_Terror&diff=160158565&oldid=160136145


On Sat, May 9, 2009 at 3:30 AM, Digwuren <digwuren@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sat, May 9, 2009 at 04:39, Andrei Dombay <wikibiophys@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> With regard to the diff (Mikkalai statement). He said he left SU in 1980s.
>> No one was able to leave Soviet Union in 1980s without KGB approval.
>
>
> It wasn't easy, but a (small) number of people managed.  Naturally, hard to
> do in Russian heartland, but in numerous areas, the border leaked just
> enough to allow an occasional adventurer through.  The largest break, the
> fall of the Berlin Wall, came in 1989 already.
>
> Even earlier than that, a popular "official" vehicle was Gorbachev's joint
> venture programme, as joint ventures were given a considerable leeway in
> communicating with the outside world.
>
> In the end years, borders were mostly in the mind.  I took my own first
> foreign trip in 1994, to compete on a Finnish mathematics contest -- note
> the year being three years after Estonia's restoration and several more
> years after relative freedom to cross Estonian-Finnish border --, and still,
> the very idea that it was *possible* to travel to foreign countries was
> quite striking for me.
>
> --
> Andres Soolo
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikipedia statistics discussion list
> folks@wikipedometer.net
> http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks
>
>

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Also some &quot;otkazniks&quot; went abroad even in 1980s, and so on. My ma=
jor point: anyone who was invited by the KGB in 1980s to work for them as a=
 computer consultant had to be at classified at least as their &quot;truste=
d contact&quot; (I will possibly make an article to explain what is it). Th=
ey would never ask someone &quot;from the street&quot;. And of course I kee=
p in mind his edits in WP:<br>
<br><a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=3DWeb_brigades&amp=
;diff=3D225117708&amp;oldid=3D225086574">http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.ph=
p?title=3DWeb_brigades&amp;diff=3D225117708&amp;oldid=3D225086574</a><br><b=
r><a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=3DInternet_operation=
s_by_Russian_secret_police&amp;diff=3D264359407&amp;oldid=3D264358991">http=
://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=3DInternet_operations_by_Russian_secr=
et_police&amp;diff=3D264359407&amp;oldid=3D264358991</a><br>
<br><a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=3DActive_measures&=
amp;diff=3D154078427&amp;oldid=3D154076928">http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index=
.php?title=3DActive_measures&amp;diff=3D154078427&amp;oldid=3D154076928</a>=
<br><br><a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=3DRed_Terror&a=
mp;diff=3D160158565&amp;oldid=3D160136145">http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.=
php?title=3DRed_Terror&amp;diff=3D160158565&amp;oldid=3D160136145</a><br>
=A0<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, May 9, 2009 at 3:30 AM, Digwu=
ren <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:digwuren@gmail.com">digwuren@gm=
ail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D=
"border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padd=
ing-left: 1ex;">
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D"im">On Sat, May 9, 2009 at 04:39, =
Andrei Dombay <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:wikibiophys@gmail.com=
" target=3D"_blank">wikibiophys@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockqu=
ote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204=
); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">

With regard to the diff (Mikkalai statement). He said he left SU in 1980s. =
No one was able to leave Soviet Union in 1980s without KGB approval.</block=
quote><div><br></div></div><div>It wasn&#39;t easy, but a (small) number of=
 people managed. =A0Naturally, hard to do in Russian heartland, but in nume=
rous areas, the border leaked just enough to allow an occasional adventurer=
 through. =A0The largest break, the fall of the Berlin Wall, came in 1989 a=
lready.</div>

<div><br></div><div>Even earlier than that, a popular &quot;official&quot; =
vehicle was Gorbachev&#39;s joint venture programme, as joint ventures were=
 given a considerable leeway in communicating with the outside world.</div>

<div><br></div><div>In the end years, borders were mostly in the mind. =A0I=
 took my own first foreign trip in 1994, to compete on a Finnish mathematic=
s contest -- note the year being three years after Estonia&#39;s restoratio=
n and several more years after relative freedom to cross Estonian-Finnish b=
order --, and still, the very idea that it was *possible* to travel to fore=
ign countries was quite striking for me.</div>

<div><br></div></div><font color=3D"#888888">-- <br>Andres Soolo<br>
</font><br>_______________________________________________<br>
Wikipedia statistics discussion list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:folks@wikipedometer.net">folks@wikipedometer.net</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks" target=
=3D"_blank">http://wikipedometer.net/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/folks</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>

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