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Date: Fri, 1 May 2009 18:22:46 +0300
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From: Digwuren <digwuren@gmail.com>
To: Wikipedia statistics <folks@wikipedometer.net>
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	Content preview:  On Fri, May 1, 2009 at 16:41, Martin
	<martint20@gmail.com> wrote: > I propose we draft an ArbCom case to get
	him desysoped. His actions are clearly against the well-known rules. As
	long as Irpendajo doesn't show up, we should have a good chance of
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Subject: Re: [WPM] Here we go again, Baltic mediation
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	Content preview:  On Fri, May 1, 2009 at 16:41, Martin
	<martint20@gmail.com> wrote: > I propose we draft an ArbCom case to get
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On Fri, May 1, 2009 at 16:41, Martin <martint20@gmail.com> wrote:

> I propose we draft an ArbCom case to get him desysoped.


His actions are clearly against the well-known rules.  As long as Irpendajo
doesn't show up, we should have a good chance of sanctions against him.

That he himself created that AN/I thread may be considered a post hoc
display of good faith, unfortunately.  I guess it'll need some reframing.
 How about guilty conscience, admission that he was going against consensus
and against policy, and perhaps unabashed side-taking in administrative
action?

<
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Hiberniantears&diff=287229946&oldid=287217446>
should be construable as not wanting to take part in discussion which, in
combination with the mediation affair, is a display of hypocrisy.  After
all, this is the sequence of events:

* Hiberiantears showed up, made a few suggestions and edits.  Consensus was
his POV doesn't match the sources, the main edits got reverted (although I
think some typofixes were left in).
* Hiberiantears requested mediation.
* A number of other editors -- several of whom had partaken in the previous
mediation --  acknowledged the mediation request, and posted various
thorough explanations of why doing a new mediation would be pointless.
* Although mediation was deemed pointless, Martin and others helpfully
listed a number of sources on Hiberniantears' talkpage so he could acquaint
himself with the scholarly sources on this topic.  (He or somebody else may
claim that dumping a large number of sources amounts to stonewalling via the
"read all or these, and until you're done, shut up" gambit.  We should be
prepared to counter this approach by "Not every library has all of those --
we offered a large number of books, but reading just a few should give
anybody a good grasp at the scholarly consensus.")
* Hiberniantears dismissed the source list in the above-mentioned diff, and
proceeded to do the anti-consensus (which he himself admits at AN/I) split,
then protecting the results.

Thoughts?


I support any reasonable action that is likely to lead significant reduction
of Hiberniantears' powers.  Probably, desysopping is easiest.  A more
creative approaches might involve getting him topicbanned from Eastern
Europe, but this is riskier, and the extra risk is probably not worth it.

-- 
Andres Soolo

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<div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, May 1, 2009 at 16:41, Martin <span dir=
=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:martint20@gmail.com">martint20@gmail.com</a>=
&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0=
 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
I propose we draft an ArbCom case to get him desysoped.</blockquote><div><b=
r></div><div>His actions are clearly against the well-known rules. =C2=A0As=
 long as Irpendajo doesn&#39;t show up, we should have a good chance of san=
ctions against him.</div>
<div><br></div><div>That he himself created that AN/I thread may be conside=
red a post hoc display of good faith, unfortunately. =C2=A0I guess it&#39;l=
l need some reframing. =C2=A0How about guilty conscience, admission that he=
 was going against consensus and against policy, and perhaps unabashed side=
-taking in administrative action?</div>
<div><br></div><div>&lt;<a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?titl=
e=3DUser_talk:Hiberniantears&amp;diff=3D287229946&amp;oldid=3D287217446">ht=
tp://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=3DUser_talk:Hiberniantears&amp;diff=
=3D287229946&amp;oldid=3D287217446</a>&gt; should be construable as not wan=
ting to take part in discussion which, in combination with the mediation af=
fair, is a display of hypocrisy. =C2=A0After all, this is the sequence of e=
vents:</div>
<div><br></div><div>* Hiberiantears showed up, made a few suggestions and e=
dits. =C2=A0Consensus was his POV doesn&#39;t match the sources, the main e=
dits got reverted (although I think some typofixes were left in).</div><div=
>
* Hiberiantears requested mediation.</div><div>* A number of other editors =
-- several of whom had partaken in the previous mediation -- =C2=A0acknowle=
dged the mediation request, and posted various thorough explanations of why=
 doing a new mediation would be pointless.</div>
<div>* Although mediation was deemed pointless, Martin and others helpfully=
 listed a number of sources on Hiberniantears&#39; talkpage so he could acq=
uaint himself with the scholarly sources on this topic. =C2=A0(He or somebo=
dy else may claim that dumping a large number of sources amounts to stonewa=
lling via the &quot;read all or these, and until you&#39;re done, shut up&q=
uot; gambit. =C2=A0We should be prepared to counter this approach by &quot;=
Not every library has all of those -- we offered a large number of books, b=
ut reading just a few should give anybody a good grasp at the scholarly con=
sensus.&quot;)</div>
<div>* Hiberniantears dismissed the source list in the above-mentioned diff=
, and proceeded to do the anti-consensus (which he himself admits at AN/I) =
split, then protecting the results.</div><div><br></div><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padd=
ing-left:1ex;">
Thoughts?</blockquote><div><br></div><div>I support any reasonable action t=
hat is likely to lead significant reduction of Hiberniantears&#39; powers. =
=C2=A0Probably, desysopping is easiest. =C2=A0A more creative approaches mi=
ght involve getting him topicbanned from Eastern Europe, but this is riskie=
r, and the extra risk is probably not worth it.</div>
<div><br></div></div>-- <br>Andres Soolo<br>

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